How Alcohol Affects Hormones During Menopause
Episode 288
I first came across Dr. Dawn’s Instagram account and was immediately drawn to her passion for helping others and the way she teaches and shares her wisdom - which is why I reached out to invite her back to the podcast to help us understand more about what hormones are the hormones that are the key players during menopause and how alcohol affects our hormones during this time.
Dr. Dawn is a Naturopathic physician with extensive experience in the treatment of substance use disorders, depression, anxiety, and eating disorders, and is doing work in ketamine therapy, which she talks about in this episode.
This episode is for you if you are a gal in perimenopause and beyond. It’s also for you if you’re not sure.
About Dr. Dawn:
Dr. Dawn is a licensed naturopathic physician in Arizona. She has specialized in addiction recovery for almost two decades, first as the medical director of an eating disorder treatment center and then as the medical director of a residential program specializing in addictions and trauma.
She is passionate about transformation and believes integrative medicine is an important component of addiction recovery.
What you’ll hear in this episode:
The different stages of transition into menopause
What hormones play a key role during perimenopause and beyond
The hormones effected by alcohol during menopause
How to approach your doctor and share about your drinking to get help
The best course of action to take when it comes to your drinking
Dr. Dawn’s services, including her latest research into Ketamine therapy
Find Dr. Dawn here:
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How Alcohol Affects Hormones During Menopause with Dr
Lori: [00:00:00] Hello there, my friend, welcome to To 50 and Beyond. I am Lori. I am your host and I'm so happy that you are here. If you are new to the podcast, this is where we talk about living an alcohol free lifestyle later in life. And if you're returning back to the podcast, You've been here before. I appreciate you so much.
I'm giving you a big virtual hug from San Diego, California. I'm the Midlife Sobriety Coach and Founder of Team Alcohol-Free. This is such a wonderful community to come in, get support for going and staying alcohol free. This is something that I missed out on. 100 percent when I stopped drinking, not having other women around me who were doing the same thing, keeping me accountable to myself and to what I wanted more than alcohol.
And then also supporting me, laughing with me, sharing with me. I love the stories that I hear inside Team Alcohol-Free. And I really truly believe this is your number one [00:01:00] tool for your toolbox. If you are looking for community, go and check out team alcohol, free linked in the show notes. I first came across our guest today, Instagram.
Dr. Dawn was someone who came up on my Instagram and this was years ago. This is her second time being on To 50 and Beyond. I was immediately drawn to her passion for helping others and the way she teaches and shares her wisdom, which is why I reached out to her to invite her back to the podcast to talk about how alcohol affects our hormones.
And this is what we're talking about today. She is talking about the key players for us, the gals in midlife and beyond during menopause and how alcohol affects our hormones during this time. Dr. Dawn is a naturopathic physician with extensive experience in the treatment of substance abuse. Ubstance use disorders, depression, anxiety, and eating disorders, and is doing work in ketamine therapy, which she talks about.
Also in this episode. At the end, if you are in perimenopause or you're in menopause and you are [00:02:00] drinking and you're not feeling your best and you're trying to make alcohol work, know that. I understand how this feels. So many women who are listening right now understands how this feels, and Dr. Dawn has your back today to teach you more about why you may not feel your best when you're drinking alcohol during menopause.
Let's get started. Here's Dr. Dawn. Hi, Dr. Dawn. Hi, Laurie. Welcome back to 250
Dr. Dawn: and Beyond. I'm so happy to see you today. I'm happy to be here. It feels like a little bit of a reunion.
Lori: It really does. I was really looking forward to this today. It's been about three years, we decided, since I think you were last on, right?
And I'm going to link that episode down below as well. We're going to talk about our hormones, and we're going to talk about alcohol's effect on our hormones. So I want to start with asking you for an explanation Of what our hormones are.
Dr. Dawn: Yeah. So hormones are chemical messengers that are released by [00:03:00] various organs to send messages throughout the body.
And so often when people think about hormones, they think about sex hormones, which that's accurate includes estrogen, progesterone, testosterone, and it also includes other things like thyroid hormones and cortisol and insulin, all these, and we have many hormones in the body. However, for the purpose of this.
Discussion. We're really going to look at the sex hormones.
Lori: Yeah, that's what I wanted to know because we're talking to the midlife gal and beyond. And I have so many different questions and I'm not sure if they're going to be in order or not. That's okay. Right. But this is where we are at this stage of life.
So what hormones are the key players?
Dr. Dawn: Primarily estrogen and progesterone. I mean, testosterone, as you go, people go through the menopausal transition that often stays within normal range. After a while, though, those levels can go down too. So it's really the estrogen and progesterone that we're focused on and really contributes to those symptoms that we [00:04:00] associate with perimenopause and menopause.
That's my next
Lori: question. The transition into menopause, what are the different stages there? Can you walk us through that?
Dr. Dawn: It can be different for different people generally, so the average age of menopause is 52. But there's a variation in that, just like when people remember being in elementary school and middle school and people getting their periods, there's a big range of when people got their first period.
And it's the same for menopause too. And generally people will start to have symptoms. Up to really it can be like seven years prior to menopause. So if you think about menopause being on average 52. Often people will start to have symptoms throughout their forties. And even some people earlier, I do have patients who have early menopause for, and they were looking back, they're like, Oh yeah, they're just realizing in retrospect where they look in the [00:05:00] rear view mirror, they're like, Oh, those were all the symptoms that I was having leading up to this.
And they were caught off guard because they're not. Talking about that with their friends because of their age, whereas people who often around 50 or so, they're talking about it with their friends. It's a common topic of conversation.
Lori: Yeah.
Dr. Dawn: And
Lori: it's so interesting and I'm so thankful that you're sharing this today because a lot of us, of course, I'm going to say most of us were not taught about the change of life.
It's something that we heard maybe growing up and we associated it with an older woman who is sweating profusely or something. It's just like the cartoons or whatever. That's what the vision I'm getting in my mind. And so yes, when we're at a stage and we're not even sure early forties for me, I think in hindsight, it was really happening late thirties, but.
I'm too young. And the doctors would tell me, you're not there yet, right? It's not the age, but it's, it'll drive you cuckoo if you're experiencing these things. And I want to talk to you about the symptoms and the experience of [00:06:00] perimenopause and what we can look for there. But it's so good and it's so comforting to know that, okay, it's a natural transition into menopause and we can do something about it.
And that's a little bit about what our podcast is about today, for sure.
Dr. Dawn: Yeah, I totally agree. And I continue to hear that from my patients that they're the phrase they say, nobody told me, why didn't anybody tell me? And it's It still surprises me. I feel like there's starting to be more conversations online as we see people like Oprah Winfrey go through menopause and other famous people.
They're like, they're sharing their experiences. However, I feel like we have a long way to go with that.
Lori: Yes, I do agree with you as far as Oprah doing her special Drew Barrymore is talking about it. Cameron Diaz people in the public eye are talking about it. Naomi Watts. She has a whole skincare line. Um, for, uh, older women and women who are going through menopause say, Oh, thank you so much.
Because back when I was first noticing it, nobody [00:07:00] was talking about it, nor were they talking about sorority or going alcohol free publicly. And it's so helpful to know we're not
Dr. Dawn: alone. And it's so wild because half the population is going to experience this. Like, why, why hasn't it been discussed? And so.
I also, when you were talking about knowing people or recognizing people would look hot or they'd feel hot, they'd be having a hot flash that that's pretty much like what most people know about menopause. I was reflecting recently. When I started one particular job, I was 30 years old and I remember the women who there was a handful of women who are going through menopause and I was thinking they are, they seem really old to me and they always seem to be getting hot.
And now that I'm in that age group, I'm like, they weren't that old. I do the same. I worked in
Lori: an office for 12, 13 years. And now I know, now I know. It's so obvious now and I've thought about that so often. Yeah, it's very interesting. So we're changing the face, menopause especially, and it's more naturally now because we're [00:08:00] here.
Of course, we're not going to be dealing with this kind of stuff when we're not going through it, but I know that first. off cycle that I had, it started to creep in these little signs and I'm like, what the heck is going on? And then I experienced all kinds of things. We hear about hot flashes. That was really not one of my main things.
I think postmenopause, I get it now. I think I'm running hot. I was just thinking about this. I turned that air conditioning down before we started. I'm running a little hotter than normal, but I wasn't going through the hot flashes and perimenopause. What else can women look out for during this stage?
Dr. Dawn: Yeah, so I think that is the common conception around menopause is, oh, it's hot flashes. I think that's gotten the most attention over the years. And for good reason, hot flashes are really uncomfortable and it's very obvious if people are having frequent hot flashes, they are around the menopausal time.
There are a lot of other symptoms. So I do hear from people about, especially people who are starting to get into the perimenopausal [00:09:00] phase. They're like. Here's another thing I hear frequently is I always had really regular cycles and recently they haven't been. They're starting to be irregular. That's really a common tip off that you are in perimenopause because there are people who have had regular cycles and they can just kind of time vacations around it or plans around it.
And then that stops because the cycles become irregular and, and cycle length and also the amount of flow can change too for people and then their symptoms that they have, I would say the most common symptoms I hear from people, the sweats and flashes and then also waking up with night sweats at night.
Another one is mood changes. So anxiety that comes up irritability. That's of course a big one. Also discomfort, vaginal dryness. That's a really common experience that people have. Urinary symptoms. They can maybe have having to pee a lot or they're having like some [00:10:00] UTIs and maybe they haven't had UTIs before or they're having increased frequency in UTIs.
Because as the hormones change the environment of the tissue, like the vaginal and vulvar tissue, that does affect like the microbiome and the anatomy. So it has an impact. Libido, that's a, that's a common one that will shift for people. Brain fog. Brain fog is a big one.
Lori: I'm shaking my head to all of these.
I've experienced all of them and I'm still experiencing some of them. And I went through perimenopause. I think I had my last. That year anniversary. And I want you to talk about that as well, because It is so important to talk about this because we just don't know, right? And I remember it wasn't always explained to me and okay, so I have to go a full year without a period before I can declare myself in menopause.
Is there the pre peri menopause stage?
Dr. Dawn: The definition of menopause is going that full year without having a period. There are a lot of people who will go almost a year and then they'll get a period and they have to start that. [00:11:00] Block all over again. And there are also different circumstances. I, I have heard from some people, maybe they would get like a COVID vaccine and then that will trigger a period.
Like they think they're just about in menopause and then that will trigger a period because anything that's going to really impact hormones could potentially affect like a flow. Not that I'm saying don't get the vaccines, but they're just different instances like that, that if it happens to just recognize that that's not unusual.
And as far as a pre perimenopause, no, really, it's considered perimenopause for that maybe close to a decade prior to having menopause, and then you can call it menopause and we can define it as menopause.
Lori: When we hear hormone imbalances, what exactly does that mean? That term is
Dr. Dawn: a broad term. I think when I think of hormone imbalances, I think of our people having symptoms that [00:12:00] are uncomfortable for them.
So that's the way I look at it. Often one thing that I utilize quite a bit is I do functional medicine lab testing on people and we're able to see are their estrogen levels and progesterone levels in a good optimal range. And so what I think about without a balance in respect to those two hormones is For some people, those estrogen levels can really go really high.
They can go low and the same with progesterone too. Often they will be out of that optimal range and that's what can cause symptoms for people.
Lori: So when somebody is experiencing this, there's a gal out there and she's just wondering what is going on. You're starting to experience a little bit of change.
And that was for me, I was 28 days to and the time and everything. And then it was like. 32 days, and it just kept going back and forth. And it was just such a long journey for sure for me. And I had to get a lot of the answers for myself. That's when [00:13:00] I really started to dig into researching menopause because I wasn't getting them from my doctor.
If a gal goes into her doctor and explains what is happening. What type of blood work should she be asking for? Is there something we can do?
Dr. Dawn: Yeah, the blood work, unfortunately, I don't find it very helpful. Because the ranges on the blood work are so broad, That's why, personally, I like to rely on the functional medicine testing.
Now, you can still get it done. It's not a bad thing to have that done. You could look at your estradiol, your progesterone, your testosterone levels. Sometimes you'll find some information. There's also a couple other hormones called FSH and LH. Those can possibly be helpful too, but overall, it's less than satisfying to get those results.
Lori: If I remember correctly, my doctor would say it had to be at a certain time. Hmm. For me to come in and get blood [00:14:00] work. Is that true?
Dr. Dawn: It depends on what's being tested. So generally it is optimal to test right after ovulation is suspected. So that window where progesterone is highest, that can be the best time to do that kind of lab work.
Lori: Are there any questions that the gal out there can ask her doctor when she goes right now that was going to help her and
Dr. Dawn: benefit her? That's a good question because what I'm hearing from a lot of people, and they're self selected, they're seeking my help out because they just haven't gotten the answers that they want.
But generally people feel really dismissed and it's important not to just shrug to say, Hey, if somebody is symptomatic, they're not feeling well, I think it is good to cover all your bases and not just assume it's hormones either. So to get a thorough workup, they're not feeling well, they're feeling depressed or low energy.
They're not sleeping well. Do some investigation around those things [00:15:00] rather than just shrugging and saying, Oh, it must be hormones.
Lori: Yeah, okay go a little bit deeper.
Dr. Dawn: Mm hmm.
Lori: And yeah, I hate hearing that as well the dismissal part and do you feel dr Don because this is how I feel and I this is what I did if I wasn't getting the answers I wasn't getting the support.
I felt dismissed. I would walk out of the doctor's office. Yeah Did they even listen to me? I don't even think that they listened to me. I would find a different doctor.
Dr. Dawn: Yeah. And it's hard. I think though, and again, this is based on the patients that I work with and also my experiences too. I think just the way that the current system is set up, it just doesn't support that kind of in depth kind of appointment anymore.
Lori: We're going to talk more about your work as well and where you're located. Definitely. Let's switch our gears just a touch when I was going through perimenopause I was grieving the loss of my mom and I thought at that time That's when I really I need some [00:16:00] I need my mom to talk to you about this and she was gone And that's when I was drinking even heavier than I had been drinking for the decades before at that time And I realized that alcohol and perimenopause did not mix.
And it was one of the catalysts to me, quitting drinking. Can you talk about alcohol's impact on our hormones?
Dr. Dawn: I definitely can. One thing that I came across in the research that I thought was pretty interesting is, and you may have heard this before as far as like life satisfaction and happiness, how it has that U shaped curve.
Have you heard about this? It will, people are happier in a young adulthood and then the levels of happiness go down around this age, fifties, forties, fifties, sixties, and then happiness raises more towards like end of life and older age. So if we think about like the menopausal years, they're right in that dip.
And I think that's important to think about too, because [00:17:00] it's not just like you're going through these huge hormonal changes. Like we're referred to as being sandwiched in, you maybe are dealing with parents who are in poor health or have passed away your caregiver, maybe for them, your caregiver for your children still, or even children with disabilities.
I know so many people who in our age group. They just, they have so much responsibility and at the same time, they have these hormonal challenges that they're dealing with too. I think it's important to look at the broad picture. So related to drinking, why do people drink? Well, there are a lot of different reasons, right?
And for you, it's interesting because menopause can be a transition for people who maybe were relying on drinking. Maybe they stop drinking like yourself. However, there's another version of that where they haven't been a drinker. They haven't been using alcohol to rely on. And then they start because well, we just talked about like some of the common symptoms of menopause [00:18:00] jacked up sleep.
As far as mood dysregulation, alcohol that provides some relief, at least in the interim, you know, we know it doesn't help longterm, but it does, it does seem like to be a solution for people. And that's really fascinating to me. And it makes sense why that would happen. Definitely.
Lori: And as you described the dip in the bottom of that, the U, that's where we're dealing with all of these extra challenges in midlife.
We thought our younger years were challenging and they were, and now we get to a different stage of challenges and it's tough. It's almost impossible to differentiate what's perimenopause and menopause. Oh,
Dr. Dawn: yeah, that can, that can definitely confuse the picture as to what's going on. So and you don't
Lori: have to agree with that.
I'm just asking, that's how I felt towards the end of it, but I'm wondering, is it and not do you feel this way, but is it harder to differentiate?
Dr. Dawn: I think it can be. [00:19:00] Absolutely. As far as some of the symptoms we were talking about, the mood dysregulation and the sweats and yeah, absolutely. Sleep issues. All those things.
Palpitations. Palpitations are a really common symptom of menopause, but also that can be caused by substances. So absolutely. Digestive issues. Yeah. It just makes the picture just harder to figure out what's going
Lori: on. Yeah, definitely. Do you ever get a gal that comes in to see you and do you ask, do you drink?
Oh,
Dr. Dawn: everybody. Yeah. So because of my work in substance use treatment, I absolutely do have that conversation with every single person. And I really, my approach is really to be that person that Creates a nonjudgmental space for them to talk about it because people frequently, in my experience, they have shame about that.
And my patient, they're kind of embarrassed if they're using substances. And I hope that [00:20:00] this is an opportunity. I've heard this from people too. Like it is an opportunity to have a conversation about that and talk about, well, why, what are the contributing factors? And can we help you with those and really try to support maybe a different approach to managing those.
Lori: Yeah, it is hard. I know the, the feelings of shame, the feelings of embarrassment. So we could say, I'm going to go to the doctor and I'm going to talk to them about drinking. We get to the office and nope,
Dr. Dawn: forget
Lori: it. Yeah. So I appreciate your approach and I know that it's not that easy with certain doctors.
How important is it for us to be open and honest about our drinking right now?
Dr. Dawn: I, I, I'm asked to support people in being open and honest about that. Hopefully they will feel like they are in a supportive environment and with a supportive practitioner there as a medical provider, it is helpful for me [00:21:00] to look at it through that lens and just.
Be able to see it gives me a broader perspective of what a person's needs might be and what might be contributing to their health issues. If I know that whole picture of what they're using
Lori: is alcohol exasperating are perimenopause symptoms.
Dr. Dawn: Yeah, so it can. So it's interesting. I think there might be more recognition in the general public about this.
I hope there is. And hopefully we're providing that service for people. So alcohol absolutely impacts women more than men. Because one of the ways it impacts women and not saying, Oh, men, men get a free pass to drink. Not at all. It absolutely affects them in all the ways too. However, women are more vulnerable in a lot of ways because it does affect estrogen levels.
And so when people drink, and this is what's [00:22:00] interesting too, you don't even have to be like a heavy drinker. I'm talking like recreational drinking people who drink occasionally, like on a regular basis, it impacts hormones. So, just if I could mention for me, one of the things around the time you and I talked last, like back in 2020, it was a big realization for me.
So I, I ha I don't have a history of substance use disorder, but I would work in substance use treatment and go out with people and we go have a drink after work or whatever. And I thought that was different. People with substance use disorders or dependency. They, they're the ones who have the health issues as a result of their substance use.
And then there are people who they can control their drinking. They have a drink. They have a drink a few times a week. They have a drink every night with dinner. That's a different category. Well, what I found out when I started to read the research was like, oh crap, no people who drink just a little bit, even it's affecting their hormones, it increases their risk [00:23:00] for a health issues, disease, cancer.
And also impacts their sleep. So that was really the turning point for me. And also to really get that message out there that any amount of drinking really has an impact on all these things. And specifically, you know, For estrogen, it does affect estrogen levels and how estrogen is metabolized in the body.
So if
Lori: somebody, and I was, thank you for sharing that. I was going to ask you how much alcohol is, does it take? How much alcohol does it take to affect our hormone levels? And I'm wondering, so I know that you talked about estrogen and progesterone for us, the gals who are listening today. What if other hormones are impacted by alcohol?
Anything? Cortisol?
Dr. Dawn: All of them.
Lori: All of them.
Dr. Dawn: Yeah. It really is. So I think that's an important point too. So There are these different, there are these different, we call axes. [00:24:00] So it's really when we think about physiology and the hormone system, they have, it's a feedback loop between the brain and the target organ.
So reproductive organs and the brain that it's going to be this feedback loop involving estrogen, progesterone, testosterone. And a few other ones too, but, but generally like that, as far as an overview, this also happens for the, between the brain and the adrenal glands. So when we're talking about cortisol, the stress hormone, it happens there, the brain and the thyroid gland, there's that feedback loop.
So when people are using alcohol, it disrupts all these different feedback communication loops. And it's really, it's very disruptive in all those areas.
Lori: Goodness. What do you recommend to someone who comes in and says, I'm drinking maybe one or two glasses a few times a week, even.
Dr. Dawn: Yeah, generally I don't, we talk about so much that first meeting, [00:25:00] I, I sort of like make a little note and we'll come back to it down the road because I want to, I want to build some rapport during that first meeting, it might be, It might put them off a little bit, but I do, I do include that in the recommendations and do look forward to having conversations about that because we are looking at all the things we're not just looking at as a holistic provider.
I am looking at the whole picture, their whole lifestyle, their diet. I also look at substance use. I think all of those come into play as far as like their
Lori: overall health picture.
Dr. Dawn: Yeah.
Lori: Do you recommend cutting back? Cutting out? Yeah. Optimally, it would be great for them to totally cut it out. That's where I landed for the most part.
Oh, yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Because for me, I know if it's on the table, it's on the table. I'm all in on alcohol and there's no moderation. So we all have to know ourselves. I appreciate, I appreciate that [00:26:00] approach that you have. Easing in,
Dr. Dawn: not
Lori: hitting, not hitting them with everything at once because it's a lot.
I'm curious, and what is the, what, and just explain to us the work that you do, because we hear about HRT, we hear about hormone replacement therapy, what do you offer your patients?
Dr. Dawn: So, that's been a big change in the last few years too. Which has been exciting to see when I graduated school 20 years ago, it was at the time when all providers, the research was like, Hey, get people off of hormone replacement therapy.
It's detrimental. And in the last few years, that pendulum has totally begun to shift again. And so more people are seeking out hormone replacement therapy and. A lot of the, the research that was suggesting it was harmful has been really just revisited and debunked. So anyway, and then also [00:27:00] as somebody going through that transitional period as firsthand experience, I'm like, Whoa, this, this is for real.
This is no joke. So, oh gosh, I have so much to say about that. I'll try to keep it concise, but I also think about as we, it's not just like managing the, I don't look at it as just managing those. Uncomfortable menopausal symptoms and perimenopausal symptoms. It's really about the long view. As we look to the next few decades of how we want to age, what are the things we're concerned about and what can we do about them?
Well, again, that holistic approach. We want to pull in good diet, good nutrition, movement, blah, blah. And I think hormones are an important piece of that puzzle. Now, it might not be for everybody and there are some contraindications. And I think I encourage most people to try it and see what they notice, because what I hear from people within days.
Within days, like they feel so much better, so it can make a huge difference.
Lori: This is good [00:28:00] news. I have a couple of questions, of course, for that. As far as hormone replacement therapy, what, this is where I want to start, what age is too late? It's too, you missed the HRT boat.
Dr. Dawn: Yeah, that's, that's a bit debatable.
I can tell you right now, the recommendation is if somebody has been in menopause for 10 years or longer. Or they haven't been on hormone replacement for 10 years or longer. It's generally recommended they don't start. Um, because it's thought maybe the, the health risk outweigh the benefits. There are exceptions to that.
I have had people who are like, no, I just, I want to go for it anyway. But generally that is what I tell people. So you have a pretty Big window to start. I do recommend people start sooner than later. We do. Well, they'll probably be more comfortable with it by starting it sooner than later. Because what happens is again, people not being informed, they're miserable, miserable, miserable.
And then, like I said, a [00:29:00] lot of the time they start HRT within a few days, like they feel better. It's all that time. They could have been doing that. So You can initiate HRT during the perimenopausal phase, it's just dosed differently, and then, of course, in menopause too. So, there are people, I'm like, hey, maybe even just try it,
Lori: see what you notice.
Yeah, I think I missed out. I, I definitely missed out because my doctors wouldn't give it to me and I've missed the boat completely and I missed out on feeling really good because I did have a miserable time. I really did. And nobody deserves that. Nobody deserves that. It's gotten better post, but I think I did.
I missed out on some good years now. They were still good. It was just, I wasn't feeling good. So do you, did you say that it, we should be on it for 10 years max? Is that what I heard? No, no.
Dr. Dawn: You to initiate treatment, so to clarify it, so let's say your last period was at 52. Really, you would want to [00:30:00] start HRT prior to 62.
Once you're over 62, that's, that's outside of that 10 year window. And Oh, what I did sooner is better than later because primarily one of the biggest concerns we have is about like bone health. And so a lot of that bone loss happens the first few years after menopause. So I think it's a really
Lori: compelling reason to start earlier.
Dr. Dawn: Okay.
Lori: Good to know. And what is it? Hormone replacement therapy? What are we looking for? Is it a patch? Is it, what is it?
Dr. Dawn: Yeah. And it depends. There is a, there are a lot of choices now as far as like conventional mainstream medicine. And that's what the research is based on. There are patches, there are pills, there are other options too.
Those are the most common ones. And then the more like alternative realm of hormone replacement therapy, which was really isn't research supported, but nonetheless, it's still [00:31:00] a really good option for people. In my opinion, that could be more like compounded options, usually a cream, but they're also like oral options too, for people.
Lori: Okay. This is great news. One more question about
Dr. Dawn: HRT.
Lori: Does alcohol affect
Dr. Dawn: its effectiveness? It's more about how you metabolize it. So when you metabolize estrogen, you, it goes down a few different like biochemical pathways and you want it to be metabolized in a way that is healthy and not like cancer causing, not causing detrimental effects on the body.
That's really the most compelling reason in my mind, why to avoid alcohol to the best of one's ability. Thank you.
Lori: Yeah, because we've learned today it affects all of our hormones, every single one. And the best thing to do, of course, first, maybe cut back and see how that goes and then cut it out. I agree.
Dr. Dawn: I realize I'm nodding and we're like, [00:32:00] it's all audio.
Lori: It's okay. I do that all the time. Uh, we talked about lifestyle changes. I know you said diet, movement, of course. What kind of diet do you recommend? Diet. Diet. Is it just depend on the person? Absolutely.
Dr. Dawn: Yeah. And I, I get so frustrated because online you see people who are like proselytizing for a specific diet and having worked with people on diet for a couple of decades now, there really is not a one size fits all with that.
I think
Lori: that's just, it's such an important part of going to see A doctor like yourself because you've got to get that personalized and I feel like I need to do it, Dr. John. I'm going to fly and come and visit you. I want to talk about where you are and some other things that you offer as well. But yeah, I feel like if you get on Instagram, it's More protein right now, like more protein, and this is geared towards menopausal women as well, you know, more protein, lifting weights, of course, walking, it all [00:33:00] sounds so easy to do.
Um, yeah, I get it. And I feel like I'm going to be forever figuring out what works best for me. This is a lifelong thing. It is lifelong. I totally agree. Yeah. What other services do you offer that will help someone who is in this stage perimenopause, menopause, and especially for looking at those symptoms, the anxiety, the sleeplessness, the mood, picking up the alcohol, maybe a little bit more to ease all of those wonderful experiences.
What else do you offer?
Dr. Dawn: Yeah. So I, as a naturopathic physician, I am trained and, and utilize a lot of like natural therapies, different kinds of nutritional supplements, herbal medicine. So anybody I meet with, there is going to be some component of that in the treatment plan. Absolutely. Yeah. And talk about the other therapy that you're involved
Lori: in.
I want to learn.
Dr. Dawn: I work part time in a ketamine assisted psychotherapy program, [00:34:00] and I'm trained in psychedelic therapies. And we are seeing, I've worked in mental health for so long, and it's just been so exciting to see how this can make a huge change for people. And also to tie it into our conversation today with substance use disorders, and we're not done yet.
With ketamine, at least the place where I work, really, we're focused on helping people who have PTSD and treatment resistant depression and seeing the huge shifts for them, just within a few treatments, even, and a lot of times that's accompanied by substance use disorders, and. What's happening is that as we address that, those underlying issues, they are using less alcohol.
They're using less of the other substances that they've been relying on. So I'm excited to see as the options expand, as we're able to treat those other underlying [00:35:00] conditions with different treatments like MDMA, hopefully in the future, or as mushrooms become legalized and LSD and all of this. That I just, I hope it, it helps, it helps with people recovering faster.
Lori: Wow. This is fascinating to me. What exactly is ketamine?
Dr. Dawn: So ketamine was, is an anesthetic and now it's being used in the area of mental health as a tool to really help the brain. So it's neat. The way it works is because what happens is it, it's administered a few different ways, whether it's orally or through an injection or IV.
And what it does is it pings the brain to create new pathways. And so it does a few, and it also is really effective with helping with, with depression and suicidal thoughts. And what's exciting is that it helps with the [00:36:00] brain's neuroplasticity. So if you think about with, you get a ketamine treatment and a few days after that, the brain is more receptive to creating new pathways.
So if you're working on sobriety. Your brain is more receptive on like creating those sobriety pathways and so it's, it's very cool.
Lori: Wow. Fascinating to me. Yeah. You don't know much about it. So thank you for sharing. Can, what, where do we start with that type of therapy?
Dr. Dawn: Oh yeah, there's, There's a, it's kind of the Wild West at this time.
There are a lot of different option to a trusted provider and see if maybe a therapist, if they know some trusted people in the community, because there are a lot of different options and not all of them might be coming from the best place as far as like support around that.
Lori: Thank you. What area are you in?
If somebody wants to come in and make an appointment with you, where are you located?
Dr. Dawn: Yeah, I'm in Tucson, [00:37:00] Arizona. You're welcome.
Lori: Okay, not that far from me for sure, right? Yeah, that's it's been so nice having you back. Dr. Don, I appreciate you so much. We learned so much today and I'm leaving this just with a really nice message to anybody.
We got to realize that doesn't take a lot of alcohol to start. Doing some damage to ourselves, our well being, our hormones, and how we age. I know this is a very important episode. Do you have any final words that you want to leave? Anything that we missed out on that you would like to share with a gal today who is going through perimenopause?
And it is feeling not quite herself.
Dr. Dawn: Yeah. I would say seek out a provider who can help you with this because a lot of this, and even if, if you're, you're not interested in hormone replacement therapy, there are other options to help manage the symptoms. And I think the menopause is a bit of a requirement.
The suffering isn't, it's pretty optional [00:38:00] in my mind. I like that a
Lori: lot. Thank you, Dr. Dawn. All right. Thank you. Thank you so much for listening. I am going to be taking a semi break coming up. Not sure what next week's episode is going to be. I'm going to be on a getaway next week with my team Alcohol Free Gals.
So if you don't see a 250 and Beyond episode next week, no, you're That there is one coming your way. If you want to join team alcohol free, don't forget the link is in the show notes. Get on in there. We still have time for April. There's lots of meetings coming up. I've got some fun things planned for you in May, in June, and I'm going to start a new summer series, how to design your alcohol free lifestyle.
This is something that I want you to get excited about. Make sure you subscribe to the podcast so you have all of the details. I will see you soon. Peace, my friend. Take [00:39:00] care.
Related episodes:
An Integrative Approach to Recovery with Dr. Dawn Bantel
5 Essential Ways to Manage Cravings and Urges Without Drinking
5 Practical Tips to Help You Stop Drinking in Midlife and Beyond
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